Ep #97: Life, Television, Meditation and Mindfulness with Mark Feuerstein

You are listening to the Overthinkers Guide to Joy episode 97. This is the one
where I have the pleasure of talking to my friend, actor, writer and director Mark
Feuerstein about life, television, meditation and mindfulness.
Let's dive in.
This is a podcast for over thinkers, overdoers and over achievers who are tired of
feeling over anxious and just want to feel better. I'm your host certified life
coach, Jackie de Crinis.
- So hi there and welcome back. So today I have a very special guest, an old
friend and colleague who is on the pod today. His name is Mark Feuerstein.
He is a successful actor, writer, producer and director. And he has worked
consistently in Hollywood since the late 1990s. Mark is known for his starring role
in the USA series "Royal Pains," which is where I know him from, and other
television credits include "The West Wing," "Sex in the City," "Prison Break," and
"The Babysitter's Club." Some of his feature credits include "What Women Want," "In
Her Shoes," and "Practical Magic." Mark grew up in New York City, graduated from
Princeton University, and won a Fulbright scholarship, which took him to the London
Academy of Music and Dramatic Arts. He then pursued his full -time acting career,
in addition to which he has Hotel Cocaine coming out on MGM Plus on June 16th,
and he can be seen in the upcoming limited series, "Lady in the Lake" with Natalie
Courtney. He lives in Los Angeles with his beautiful wife and three children and
today. Thank you, Mark, for joining me. Woo! You nailed that intro.
Thank you very much for that. I am so over the moon to be here. I have to tell
you, I love your new life as a life coach and guru and sage.
And you'll tell me more about how to define what you are. Or let's not define it.
I was going to say, I think that's already too many adjectives. I would start with
life coach, but guru is definitely a bridge too far and sage is just a beautiful
compliment. So I'll take that one. Great. Because I love all things introspective,
transcendental that give us perspective and presence.
And I'm a meditator and I just have been so excited to get on here with you
because I know it's not going to be your typical podcast where we just get to the
stories of our business and our life in the business, but it will go deeper. And
somehow, I don't know how. I'm just excited to talk to you in that context. So
that is a great segue because I wanted to actually start this interview and catch
up with you 'cause it has been so many years since I've gotten to see your
beautiful face and hear your voice. But I have to tell you that it was you when I
first moved to Maui and was telecommuting as a television executive in 2009.
And you sent me a book. Did you know that? - I vaguely remember that,
so vaguely. - Yeah, we went to lunch. we were having sushi in Studio City and your
third child had just been born and you were going through a whole host of things.
But your third child was born. That third child is now 13 years old. She's 14.
14. So, wow, 14 years. And literally, I remember that sushi lunch like yesterday
because we were just doing all the things you just talked about, which was we were
talking about spirituality and connection and the human dynamics and life and death
and medical conditions, which of course is, we'll get to that too, because that's
royal pain. And the book that you sent me when I moved to Maui was Wherever You
Go, There You Are by John Kabat -Zinn, who was kind of like my first introduction
to even The world of meditation. I didn't start meditating until eight or nine years
ago. So it took me a while Yeah, and I only came to it dragging and screaming
because I was like I can't But I remember you were an early adopter of meditation
and I was so inspired that no matter how hard your schedule was because you had a
insane schedule being the lead a very very successful television series in well
pains, you would get up no matter what time your call time was and you would
meditate. And I was like, wait, what? If your call time's like 7 a .m. and you've
got to commute and you're like, yeah, I get up and I meditate. And I just love
that. I love that commitment to yourself. Yeah. And talk about it. Oh, yeah, sure.
That book is so special. And John Kabat -Zinn was really my gateway drug to
mindfulness and meditation. - Yeah. - Funny enough, I study with his son,
Will Kabatzin, who is amazing and beginning a four week workshop that I'm gonna
forward you an email about, starts Thursday. Just two hours a week, you might enjoy
it, I'll send it to you. But I've done probably five workshops with him. We most
recently did the Four Noble of Buddhism. And he kind of walked us through each and
in an experiential kind of way. You know, when I was dating my wife Dana,
I ran into an actor I had been doing Good Morning Miami with Jerry Burns,
who's a very talented actor, a lovely guy. And he turned me on to the power of
now. And that was what put my head in the tiger's mouth, so to speak,
with regard to what is this brain, this programming, this spiraling mind that just
keeps going all the time and is running me all the time? And how do I get any
distance from it? I mean, as you know, Jackie, from our biz, like, A, our business
makes us crazy, B, actors are even crazier than our business makes us. And There's
so many things about it that keep you from remembering that you are enough.
And so meditation just brings me back when, you know, rather than solving all the
issues of my life that involve external validation and whatnot that I'm hunting for
constantly with one breath, with three breaths, with five to 20 minutes of breathing,
if I can even do it 30, 20 % of the time can bring you back to yourself.
And John Capiton has a book coming to your senses. He has a book, Full Catastrophe
Living. And that guy really, when I finally got to wherever you go, there you are.
It was so simple. Like I would just sit in my comfy chair with a blanket and read
a passage from wherever you go, there you are. And they're the perfect size 'cause
they're just like a page and a half. And then you just dive in. And I don't know
if something about it always felt so exotic. And there are times where I remember
that I'm just sitting in a chair and like time is passing. It could be so boring.
And sometimes it is, but like you remember how special life is. You remember that
it's a miracle I can see and hear and breathe and touch and taste and all of it.
So I'm very grateful for meditation and the journey I've been on with it for so
long and I love that I helped you get to it. You did. I read the book.
I loved it. Obviously wherever you go there you are is an incredible phrase and I
think It was in "Buckaroo Bonsai," do you remember the quote? - I don't.
- I think it is, no matter where you go, there you are. And I don't know if he
was parroting that because that became like a catchphrase in the '80s. - Oh, I
didn't remember that. I didn't know. - It was one of my favorite Peter Weller
movies. Or if it predated that, I don't know which. But when I moved to Maui the
first time, I moved twice. But in 2009, everybody was like, Oh my God, all your
problems are solved because you moved to paradise. And I used to say, I moved to
paradise, but I came with me. And it was a variation of no matter where you go,
there you are. Because the thing is, it's great, as you know, to go on vacation,
it is great to go to beautiful places. It's great to travel. It's great to give
yourself a break. But if you don't work out your stuff, it follows you.
Yeah. Or you follow you. I have to share with you, you're eliciting instantly my
favorite quotes about that experience. The act of becoming an actor is instantly
taking your life off the rails of that academic schedule that you had been on for
whatever, 18 years, and suddenly you're free at three o 'clock in the afternoon,
and Shakespeare has this quote just to go real pretentious for a second.
Prince Howe says, "If all the year we're playing holiday, then to sport would be as
tedious as to work. But when they seldom come, they wished for come, and nothing
pleaseth but rare accidents." Which is to say, like, if every day we're a holiday,
if you move to Hawaii, And every day the sun is shining and every day you're
surfing, then suddenly no day is a holiday and you need to do the work to find
your purpose. And that's how it feels as an actor sometimes when you're, you know,
I mean, Robin Williams has another way of saying it, which is when I'm working,
that's the vacation. When I'm not working, that's the job. - Yes. - And I feel that
way about my life as an actor. And there's a lot of downtime, a lot of downtime.
Here we are chatting at three o 'clock in the afternoon. And I'm so grateful that I
can be here and that I am free. But you also cherish the time when you're on a
set and working. Yeah. Yeah. I feel that way. And I've talked about this a lot in
various forms, newsletters and podcasts. I feel that way now as a coach, when I'm
working, it's like a vacation. I didn't feel that way in my television career,
but not because I didn't love television. I actually loved and love television. I
love it as a medium. I love it as a spectator. I love it as being part of it
and contributing to the degree that I did. I just was on an end of it that was
just so insanely and exhausting, but that's what was exhausting about it. Not the
act of helping shepherd television shows to the air and watching people throw into
amazing TV stars and movie stars that they did. - But Jackie, I just wanna take a
moment for all your listeners so they know what a badass television executive you
were. Because you not only put the blue skies mission of shows like "Royal Pains"
and "White Collar" and "Burn Notice" and I'm not gonna be perfect about which ones
you were more intimately involved in. Suits, all the "Blue Sky" shows that were
ushered in in that era, but you were also a genius about reality TV with,
is it Chris Lee who knows best? I remember you were watching all the tapes of
Chris Lee and his family while we were visiting you in Hawaii, and you were like,
this guy is something. He is just something America has never seen before. And then
of course you were right, it took off. And so, you know, even though you have put
that life in the rear view, it's just another example of your natural talent.
- Well, I thank you, I take the compliment, but I'll tell you the parts of it that
I loved the most are the parts of it I now get to do as a coach. Which is like
this, like sitting and talking to people about what matters to them, what's
important, and getting rid of the demons, getting rid of the doubt and the spiraling
of "I didn't get the job" or "I did get the job" or "I want to feel happier in
my family" or whatever it is, getting people to meditate, getting people to look
inwards so that they can have more success outward. Like that part, I did that as
a TV executive too, but now I get to do it like all day every day. So I love
it. - It's amazing. I actually was, this Saturday, I was at a friend's graduation
party. She had been a comedy writer and she became a therapist. She did a two year
master's program and was away from her two beautiful daughters and husband a lot
just to get that degree. And all her classmates were there and all our friends in
our community were there. It was a very unconventional, like you don't have that
kind of party every day where it's your 53 year old friends graduation from her
master's program. And now she's gonna be a therapist, but she's incredible. She's
meant to do this. She found her calling at this stage of life.
And it's so special and powerful and beautiful. - Well, and one of the things that
I talk about quite a bit is that like you're never too old, right? You can go
back to school or you can reinvent your career or you can, if you need be, remarry
or fall in love or find love or change your scenery. Like you're not too late. I
mean, I started coaching when I was 55 years old and - Yeah, it was the career I
was meant to do. - Yeah, it's amazing. I have a not totally appropriate King Lear
quote now. This is for people who are having a tough time, but it also applies to
everything we're talking about. 'Tis not the worst so long as you can say 'Tis the
worst.' - Ooh, explain that to me. Okay, so I-- - If you're alive-- - Uh -huh.
- And you can say, This is the worst. This is the fucking worst. It's not the
worst. 'Cause you're a lime and you can say it. It's Shakespeare just reminding you
as long as she comes days, lays her praise. Your toes are still tapping. Thank you
everybody. Classing it up Mark Foyerstein.
- Too funny, too funny. - It's a Mike DeMone from Fast Times at Ridgemont High.
- You've just gone from two Shakespeare quotes, which both of which had needed to be
explained to me. And then you've referenced "Fast Times" at Ridgemont High in the
same sentence. So now, "Royal Pains," the show that we met on,
although actually I knew of you before "Royal Pains," obviously, which is that I did
a show at ABC called "Once and Again." - Oh my God! - And you came as a guest
star, playing the boyfriend of the sister, I believe. - It was the boyfriend of
Susanna Thompson. The show centered Billy Campbell and Seal Award. They were each
divorced and they were trying to figure out their new relationship in the wake of
their respective divorces. And Susanna Thompson played Billy Campbell's X, Y.
So when I was Leo, the bike guy-- - The message, I mean,
was I a messenger? - Yeah, I think you brought in either like-- - I might have been
a bike messenger. - I think you brought in either lunch or you brought in paperwork.
I can't remember, but there was some kind of like message or something. - Something,
yes. Yeah, I was definitely on a bike and I just finished listening. It's crazy
that you're mentioning once and again. That's where the spiritual part comes in here
somehow because I literally yesterday finished listening to Ed's wicks entire
Autobiography of his entire career called hits flops and other illusions,
and I highly recommend it Oh, I'll definitely listen to it. He is so brilliant and
so articulate and Has had such an amazing career and And I was like part of it in
three ways. Once again, I was in his movie Defiance and of the movie Abandon, which
Steve Gagan wrote and directed, which I didn't realize was a disaster for him until
he mentioned it as a post script at the end. But it's an incredible book. And yes,
once again, was such a great experience. And I got to meet Evan Rachel Wood, who
was like such an artist and like, it was incredible. So you popped onto the screen,
which had popped onto my dailies in my office. And I was like, oh,
who is this guy? This guy has such electricity and charisma and he's so handsome.
And I like ran down the hall to our head of casting and I was like, do you know
who this guy is? And she said, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm like, we have to use him
in something. And then you ended up like in a New York minute getting Good Morning
Miami. - Yup, that's right. - And then you were gone, you know, on that. And then I
left ABC and went to USA and we were just at the very, very, very beginning of
creating new shows and whatever. And so we did "Monk" obviously in the dead zone
and then "Psych" and eventually "Royal Paint." And I'm like, "We got Mark Forrest in
your back." - That's amazing. That's amazing how life works. How life was I probably
never told you that story because we wouldn't have interacted I wasn't on the set
of once and again. I was seeing the dailies in my office But I remembered from the
moment I saw your first frame. I was like, oh my god, is he something? Thank you
so much Thank you for saying that I'm so touched that you remember that and I'm
I'm just blown away by the way life works That you could have had that moment in
your office about me that I would go on to do a show that doesn't go for that
long and then other things and then suddenly we come back to do the greatest show
of my career, Royal Pains, and then we get to be here today. Like that's just--
- I know, it is incredible. - That's what I love about life is like if you stick
around long enough, if you just stick it out, everything pays off, comes back,
you get to see like the fruits of your labor, you know, just in this moment with
you. - And it is, it's little seeds. And by the way, that's just one of the many,
many themes that I wanna talk about, which is like, we can take massive action as
we say. We can work really hard and get straight A's and like you did, you know,
go to an Ivy League and pursue a career, but some of it is passion, some of it
is hard work, some of it is luck, Some of it is belief in ourselves,
just pure perseverance. And there's no chocolate chip cookie,
Toll House recipe, perfect recipe. I mean, we do our best. But when you show up
and you do what you did, which was you were an academic and you were a great
student and a great actor and a handsome charming guy, You were all the things. But
then you also worked incredibly hard at your craft. You weren't just like, yeah, I
went to an Ivy League school. Yeah, I got my degree in dramatic art and phoning it
in. You're like, oh no, I'm willing to take the bike messenger in this series on
ABC and see where it goes. And yes, I'll do sitcoms and yes, I'll do drama and
yes, I'll do features. And yes, I'll play an ancillary character and yes, I'll be
the leading man. - Yeah. - And it's all hard work and belief and commitment.
- 100%. And it's a hustle. I mean, it's so hard,
this business. It's writing high in April, shot down in May, and you're waiting to
see what June will bring constantly. - Yeah. - And my work,
just to go there for a second, is finding the line between pushing,
both in my acting and in my daily life, and allowed, because yes,
I did all the things. Thank you for saying that. You know, the hard work of
building a good resume to get into college and then totally throwing that resume out
to follow my bliss, as Joseph Campbell said, and auditioned for a play and then
doing, you know, 15 plays at Princeton and then getting a scholarship, which I took
because I didn't get into any of the drama schools, NYU, Yale, ART at Harvard,
rejected by all of them, but got this free year at Lambda in London,
courtesy of Senator Fulbright's scholarship. I went there, studied clowning,
I mean, out of nowhere. My best friend was from the conservatoire in Paris, and he
said, "Mark, I know you're feeling very good about yourself. Maybe you tried to
study clowning with this guy," which I did, which put me right back in my place if
I had gotten a little cocky in drama school. And then you're suddenly, again,
free at three o 'clock in the afternoon, waiting for a voiceover audition at some
casting office when I'm 23 years old, biking around New York City,
preparing for my role as a bike messenger on once again. - I love it, I love it,
but you just never know. And I think that being willing to go on the journey and
willing to do what you have to do to make ends meet in between while you're on
the journey. - Yeah. - Royal Pains is having a little bit of a resurgence. Yeah,
it's been crazy. It's been on Netflix. They bought a new cycle of it,
which we're very happy that they did. And I am feeling it. I mean,
it's crazy how many emails and calls and in the airport, like it's almost bigger
now than it was when we were on cable. Well, that was - True, for suits too.
- Yeah, well, suits had a crazy explosion. We've had a nice explosion. I wouldn't
say it's suits level, but I mean, those guys are, I'm watching the NBA playoffs,
they're doing the T -Mobile commercials. I'm waiting for Paulo and I to get that
call, but still, by the way, we're available T -Mobile, we're available, but we did
great. And there's talk of a possible, follow up a movie, we'll see,
fingers crossed. But like, I'm just so grateful that I got to have a second life.
And like, my son, who has never seen anything I've done, he's now 16.
Except for a movie I made, I don't know what prompted him to watch it. It was the
only thing he'd ever seen. It was Larry Gay, renegade male flight attendant, a
comedy in the vein of "Airplane" and "Anchorman." We made it for a very low budget
and it looks it, but the director did an amazing job. It actually looks great, but
anyway, Frisco turns to me and he goes, "Dead, not your best work." Okay,
thanks Frisco. - Oh, I love the honesty. - The honesty, yeah. - I love it.
- Kids don't care. But then Suddenly after that moment, which of course I was
thrilled about, he's watching the entire series of Royal Pains and I have to examine
myself because it was one of the first times I sat and watched TV with him because
he watches a bunch of Dreck and I'm like, "Mark, is the story really that the time
you finally took to really watch TV with your son was when you were finally on the
screen, no, that can't be, yeah, it's, it's, there's something to it. No, I've
watched a lot with him, but it was very fun to see him watch it. - That is fun.
And what did he think of your work on eight seasons? - Eight seasons, yeah. He
said, then you're a pretty good actor. - You're like, that's how we have the house
we live in. - Right. By the way, I call it the house that Rauschen Chewie built
because of our executive producers on "Royal Pains." - There you go, there you go.
So tell me a little bit about the new series on "MGM +." - Yeah, just to go back
to the moments when you get a part, which are each their own experience.
I wanna share the "Royal Pains" moment very briefly and then lead into the "Hotel
Cocaine." They're both great moments, but in the case of Royal Pains, it was a
journey. I tested against a bunch of actors and Bonnie Hammer said no initially.
And my manager, Stephen Levy, at the time, put her face on his screensaver and
would not relent until she saw more materials. He sent her more materials from my
movies and other TV shows, and she gave me a second chance, which is what the show
is all about. The theme of Royal Pains is second chances. I was blackballed by
every hospital in New York. I get a second chance in the Hamptons. Mark Foyerstein,
Bonnie Hammer gave me a second chance. I remember I was in Plummer Park in
Hollywood with my, I guess she must have been a year or two,
maybe two and a half with Lila, who is going to college in the fall.
And I get the call from my manager, you got the part and I pick her up and I
just swing her around and around in a circle. I'm sure I made her nauseous,
but it was just one of those moments. And so to flash forward through the random
stuff I've gotten to do, which has all been fulfilling in its own ways, from a
prison break to a wet hot American summer, to creating a show with my wife called
9JKL for CBS, to other things, movies, stuff.
I auditioned for this show called Hotel Cocaine. It's actually called Untitled Miami
Project at the time. For a showrunner named Chris Broncato who because of his
pedigree he created Narcos and the godfather of Harlem and the script is fantastic
about the drug trade in Miami in 1978 at this hotel called the Mutiny Club which
was real in Coconut Grove where all the rock stars did their drugs and all the
coke dealers, the
from, you know, who just escaped Castro's Cuba. And some of them, you know, went
the straight narrow and some of them became drug dealers. And I'm playing Burton
Greenberg on this audition, the owner of the hotel, the owner of the Mutiny Club.
And I've got my plate with my powdered sugar for cocaine that I'm sporting in the
scene. And there's a, there's a moment in the, in the scene where Hunter S.
Thompson is a guest at my hotel. I think he's doing a puff piece, but it turns
out he's doing an expose on my family, my rich Republican family, and I'm the
Democratic liberal hippie black sheep. And he says, do you know that your family
exploits your workers? And I just convert or translate this English speech into
Spanish and I say exploit. Do you know my keen seniors? I've been to in the last
five years. Todo la gente que trabajan aquí son mi familia, whether you're a busboy
or a manager, tu eres mi familia real. Anyway, I went for it on this audition,
on this tape. My representatives loved it. Anyway, we sent it in. I find out that
people liked it. I get on a Zoom with Chris Broncato. He looks at me across the
Zoom, in the beginning of the Zoom, no, like, who's auditioning, who, none of that.
He just says, Mark, When I get self -tapes, we usually get 40 to 50.
It usually comes down to two people and you like one more than the other and you
know, you vet it and you go through all the people. In this case, for this role,
there was one person and it's you. - Oh. - And that's never happened to me where
they just, without any more hoops, just gave it up in the most mengy way.
And I'll never forget that moment because, of course, it was in the middle of the
hills and valleys of this life and this career where you're desperately-- Oh,
how good does that feel? Felt so good. So I have no recollection of Bonnie giving
you a second chance on "Roll Pains." The only thing I remember about the casting of
it was that Hallow looked so much like you, we had to rewrite it to be brothers
because otherwise it was weird. - Exactly right. And to me, that was an example of
the magic of television because a movie is a story that you're not gonna be able
to change, but a TV show is an organic beast that when we tested together between
our schnauzes and our brillopad hair They said, "These guys are brothers." - They
look like brothers. - Yeah, they look like brothers. - And they changed the whole
tenor of the show. - Right, instead of best friends. So that I remember very, very
well. I don't ever remember a-- - A rejection. - Should have cast Mark.
No, I just remember-- - Yeah, I mean-- - But maybe because in my mind, I was like,
"Oh, goodie, I finally get to cast the guy who played the bike messenger once and
again." So - To me it was like a done deal. - I think we tend to wanna put these
moments in the background because we want the great story and it's all joy from
there because what an experience. But I honestly think it's just a tribute to Bonnie
and you and the team that it wasn't a no in the end.
It was a, we care so much about this show. We view ourselves,
even though we are only a fledgling cable network at this time. Monk has been a
success. Burn Notice is a growing hit. Two shows that people are watching,
but it wasn't the network that cranked out six hits in a row,
Suits and White Collar and then Mr. Robot and all of it, the belief in itself,
the belief Bonnie, you, Jeff Wachtell all had in your content that like you better
bring your A game. And we're not sure we're handing this to anybody. And I had to
work for it. And I, you know, I'm lucky that I have the tenacity and I'm not
proud. I don't stand on ceremony like, okay, give me another shot, I'll go in and
try to win it. - That's who you are in every possible way. It's like your work
ethic was insane. I mean, I don't know how many times I visited the set or saw
you at events outside of the set, but never out of energy, always leading like Pied
Piper, like let's go, let's go, let's go. And I was like, do you ever Do you
ever, you know, and even when you were here with on years ago on vacation with
your kids You're like in the pool Catching one off the water slide playing this
game going in the ocean doing that changing whatever I don't know if there was
diapers involved the grand why Leia, which is where we stayed. Yeah, that was so
fun and crazy Yeah, that was like like we were in the shit in it with the kids
carrying one, throwing one down the slide on the beach. - This one wants this one
thing to drink. This one's gonna get sunburned. This one did it in all different
ages. And I'm like looking at you and I'm like, how in the universe do you have
the energy for this? And you're like, I love it. And you brought the same
exuberance to parenthood that you did to your being the lead in a show,
incredible, incredible. So I guess it's all meditation, right?
- Yeah, that's it. It's just, I can assure you, I exhaust my wife and most people,
I do love my life. I do love the time I have with my kids. I know it's starting,
the clock is ticking on one leaving the house and soon another, and then another,
and then it'll be the empty nest. But my grandmother always said, "This day will
never come again. This day, this exact day made up of these parts in this moment
of your life will never come again." And she lived that way. I mean, she did. And
she raised six children on the Lower East Side of Manhattan, And my father grew up
in a bedroom with his four other brothers, five boys in one room, his sister Rena
and another and his parents in the other room above a shoe store in a tenement
where my father was, you know, as a baby put in a milk crate on the fire escape.
That was his nursing room. That was his baby room. And he was never happier,
you know, playing punch ball in the schoolyard. And So that energy of the joy of
life, not requiring anything fancy, just that we're alive,
that we're together, I do carry that in me too. Being inculcated in us and he
lives it every day and I'm so blessed to have him still in my life. He's,
you know, we just FaceTime with my parents last night. - Is he still wearing a bow
tie every day? - Every day, Jackie, what a memory you have. - Of course. - He goes
casual to like my nephew's basketball games and other things, but yes,
he goes to that office every day. I can't say where's a bow tie every day, but
for 55, 60 years as a practicing attorney in Manhattan, bow tie,
suspenders, sock garters. There was a moment, I mentioned that my wife and I
produced a show, 9JKL. It was based on my family in New York. - I knew that, yes.
- The two apartments we have, my father bought the apartment. I grew up in 9K, he
bought 9J and that's where I crashed when I go to New York and we literally didn't
change, not that it's a great title, I mean no one knew what the hell that meant.
But anyway, 9JKL, those are the three apartments 'cause there was another one at one
point in time. And there was a moment because my father was played by Elliott
Gould, who I love, who I talk to once every few months. I love him so much. And
he's dressed in his wardrobe in his bowtie, in his suspenders. My father is on the
set for the filming of the pilot in his bowtie, in his suspenders. And he goes
right up to Elliott Gould. He goes, "Elli, you've got to fold the corner down.
That's how they know you're tidying." >>> I - I love it, even giving him wardrobe
notes on his own character. - I was like, "Dad, please just back off. "Just let the
guy play." - No, that's so awesome. - Yeah, it is. - That's so awesome. - He's the
one of a kind, my dad. - Let me ask you in our few remaining minutes, I just
would love to know the exuberance and the work ethic clearly comes from multi
-generations of your family, starting with your grandmother, your father, all the
things. The meditation came from whom? What did you say? Was the one who inspired
you initially? - Well, I mean, that was happenstance. I was doing a play at Lincoln
Center, ran into Jerry Burns on that Barnes and Noble on the Island at Broadway and
67th Street. He's been through the steps and all. He's definitely,
He's a leader of that. He's a sponsor to so many who've been through the AA
program. I'm sure he's fine with me revealing that. He's such a leader in that
space. And he just said, get the power of now by Eckhart Tolle. - Oh, that was the
beginning. - And look, it's so LA, I'm not doing anything to buck the stereotype of
the woo woo LA actor, but it put me on a path. And I remember being with this
woman in the valley who taught out of a mini mall. We would go for free Fridays.
It was a meditation. And I learned about, you know, just practicing mindfulness. And
my mother, who is 86 now and getting on when we were talking to a geriatric
psychologist about her well -being, they said,
you know, the best thing for her is mindfulness. And I was like,
wow, when I was in my 20s to when you're in your 80s or 90s,
mindfulness is a key. 'Cause it's just like here we are,
breathing and walking and living this life. And the question is, would you like to
be present for that? Or would you like to just be constantly ripped away from it
by your brain, which will do it without any effort. It will just go and take you
out of your moments. And we only have so many of them. So when I read those books
from John Kabat -Zinn to Tick -Not -Hahn to Sharon Salzburg,
Joseph Goldstein, I've been through all of them. I've been on yoga retreats and
meditation retreats. I just found a home that is perfectly aligned with my Jewish
values. 'Cause I also go to synagogue, a beautiful synagogue here in LA named Ikar
with Sharon Brouse as our rabbi. And when Addie, which you may or may not have
planned to get to, but when Addie was sick, when she was five months old, she had
a rare congenital heart defect. And Dr. Starnes at CHLA was performing heart surgery,
open heart surgery on her. He did it twice. And during the second one, before which
he said, it's 50 /50 that we have to use an artificial pig valve to replace her
mitral valve, which means she'll be on kumitan for the rest of her life and have
to have it replaced every 10 years, and it's 80 /20 that she make it. I go
outside, Sharon Brous shows up, I'm holding hands with my wife. We are both
meditating and praying to that Jewish God that I used to wish for making captain of
the team or getting that A or, you know, getting president of the class or getting
into college. And now it's, God, please let my daughter live, guide that doctors
scalpel perfectly across her heart. So she, and then I come upstairs and he gives
me a thumbs up that she has almost a clean bill of health. She has lived, thrived,
she's 14 and living a perfectly normal life. And so it's this combination of faith
and presence that gets me through this crazy up and down life I'm living.
- Love that. Love the merger of the two. - Yeah. - Because I always say that I'm
such an advocate and proponent of meditation. And I always impart on people
meditation, it does not have to be religious. You do not have to be indoctrinated
into any religion. You don't have to believe in God. You don't have to do it. It's
just spirit and connection to yourself. That's it. But you can also beautifully
combine it with whatever religion you believe in. And so I love that you took
something that was in your genetic makeup and your upbringing and your culture and
blended it with something that is mindful and spiritual and not part of Judaism,
prairies, but not meditation per se. - Yeah, no, I mean, I would call myself a jubu
if that meant anything to anybody, but you know. - So my girlfriend used to call
it, my girlfriend Leslie used to say, "Were boo -ish?" Which was - - I love that,
that's the reverse. - Yeah. Who is? That's so cute. I love that. Because we're both,
you know, kind of like Zen and spiritual and but raised, you know, in a certain
way. So I love that. I love the combination of it. But what I was going to ask
you is, do you have any other daily practices in your life that are sort of like
your pillars, your tent poles, or that you do every day to keep your mind,
body, or even just your professional practice current. And what I mean by that is
like, I have this model that I talk about in every episode practically called home,
which is hydration, observe your levels, meditate, exercise. And observe your levels
just means, do I need to eat, do I need to sleep? Like being aware of what your
body needs, checking in with your home, so that you're not just like all over the
place. 'Cause we all know when we're dehydrated or hungry, or if we haven't
exercised or in my case haven't meditated, usually we feel off. We feel scattered,
we feel anxious, we feel depressed, whatever. So do you have any sort of daily
pillars that you do to keep yourself centered? Sure, absolutely. I realized I haven't
done yoga in a while, so I need to get back to that. I sometimes do it on
Peloton with Kristin McGee, who I met and love. She's been on my podcast. Oh,
really? Yes. Oh, my God. So during the pandemic, I was obsessed with her class.
And so thanks to social media, I just reached out and told her how fabulous. And
before I know it, I'm in New York, I'm doing a private on the Upper West Side at
her house. It turns out she would go to the Hamptons where I would go for a month
or two to be with my family. And I'm organizing whole groups of people to go live
with her at somebody's house to do a yoga class. So I love her and Vinnie Marino
is another one here in LA who I love. But like Jackie this morning, I got up at
four. I mean, my sleep is erratic to say the least and I'm a morning guy. As you
could probably tell, I was up at four, 10, 420. And I'm just like, I know myself,
I'm going to be up for an hour. And then if I have a chance at going back to
sleep, it'll be 5 .30. So let me get up, let me go meditate now. And I sat in my
chair and I read a little Tick -Not Han about breathing in. I am aware I'm
breathing in, breathing out. I'm aware I'm breathing out. And then I sat for, oh,
actually I did a guided meditation with Joseph Goldstein. And then I did another 15
minutes just in silence. But also when I woke up, I had a dream and I do some
dream work with a woman in Kim Gillingham in LA and I wrote down this crazy dream
I had which was truly like sent for all my fears. It was Chris Broncato,
the story I told you telling me, I don't know if we're gonna keep the scene and
we may have to cut your whole part from season one. I'm like, ooh, like a dagger.
And then he goes away and I'm sitting there sitting there, stressed out, everything
comes back, goes, we're gonna keep it in. And I'm like, oh, thank God, thank you.
But if you have to cut, and I say something in a very pleasery, but if you have
to, I get it, you know? I'm part of it. And it was just such a everything about
me in a nutshell. So I wrote it down and I sent it to an acting coach. I work
with dreams sometimes. So we're gonna have a session about that. Writing in my
journal is from the artist's way. It can be really useful to just get it all out
on if I have to do it on my computer because that's I can type faster than I can
write and then just walking my dogs in the morning and sometimes I'll be lucky
enough to go into my jacuzzi and read the New York Times on a Sunday afternoon and
reading a Mary Oliver poem and taking a walk with my wife at five or six in that
perfect twilight time of day here in LA These are the moments where I'm in
communion with something greater than myself and when I remember to breathe and that
I am On this earth and breathing. I am so grateful for that moment because It is
not as often as I would like there are you know, I'm constantly flying by the seat
of my pants There's so much going on three kids a career as a writer and an
actor. - But it sounds like you do practice mindfulness all day long because you
start your day with meditation and sometimes you're doing yoga or sometimes you're
walking your dogs or sometimes you're walking with your wife. Sometimes you're just
appreciating the twilight of Los Angeles in the late afternoon and that's mindfulness.
- For sure. I'm not always present to it, but Sharon Salzburg, a great meditation
teacher and mindfulness coach has said if you can just take this one breath,
like that's it just focus on this one breath. You don't have to worry about the
whole day or the year of meditating perfectly. Yeah. Just take one breath and be
there for it. Like that's
- Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is a great place to say thank you.
This has just been an incredible conversation and reconnection and I love,
love, love this visit. I love this interview and I love hearing from you and seeing
you and just your exuberance for life and what you do is so So contagious.
Thank you. Thank you. Jackie, you have such a special place in my heart. Not only
did we make a great TV show together, but we have a connection that we've always
had from when I told you about meditation at Sushi in 2009,
which is so crazy. But I'm just so grateful for you.
I knew this would be special. I knew we'd get to talk about all the special,
ethereal, deep things that I appreciate about my life and that you bring to so many
that you coach in your life. And it was everything and more. Thank you.
Thank you. And I appreciate just the time, because like I said, between the series
and like you said, three kids and one graduate. Right? Like this is how we have to
connect sometimes. next sometimes through a Zoom schedule for a podcast.
Great. I'll take it. I love it. Me too. Me too. But next time it's going to be
in person for sure. Yes. A meal when you come to LA for sure. I would love that.
All right, Mark. Thank you so much. Pleasure. And I will talk to you soon.
Such a joy. Thank you, Jack.
If you would like to learn more about working with me as a coach, you can connect
with me through my website at jackiedecrinis.com, that's J -A -C -K -I -E -D -E -C -R -I -N -I -S .com.